Keisha TK Dutes on building your own internship
Hey y'all!
Welcome back to Starting Out, from Transom and me! If this is the first issue you’re reading, I’m Alice, a podcast producer and reporter.
In the past few months, a lot of my friends have quit their jobs. Hell, I even did it recently. After pretty relentless work over the past year and a half, so many are completely depleted and have little patience for even the most well intentioned team building Zooms. I’ve found myself sending a lot of people this piece on burnout from Ed Zitron’s newsletter:
“If you are having a conversation about burnout, it’s because you have failed as an organization, on a small or large scale. The solution isn’t to look at workers and say “okay, you’ve got burnout, time to relax,” but to look at the root causes and work out how to avoid that in the future, be it through not piling on so much work at once or giving them direct assistance to do the work.”
A wellness day or two isn’t enough. Meditation isn’t enough. A hot bath is wonderful, but it’s not enough. Everyone I know is running on empty right now and taking on even more work — whether that’s starting a new semester, launching projects (guilty!) or navigating ever changing COVID precautions.
What do we do? A friend said to me recently that we’ve stopped acknowledging (at work or at school) that we are in a state of crisis. Even though those “in these uncertain times” emails made me roll my eyes after a few months, there was something nice about seeing people voice that the world is really bad right now. If we’re not operating at the peak of our powers, it’s okay. There’s no such thing as a podcast emergency.
This is all to say that putting on a peppy face and looking for jobs feels especially difficult. So if you’re not in a place to do that and need a break, that’s okay. And if you’re burned out but not able to take a pause from the job search, I hope you get space for rest soon.
Since Starting Out launched I’ve gotten notes from several readers who are entering the audio industry later in life and are feeling discouraged.
And that makes sense, because lots of internships limit themselves to applicants who are fresh out of college or would require someone making a career change to take a massive pay cut.
When I get emails from people in that space I direct them to this episode of Life Kit hosted by Keisha TK Dutes. It’s packed with actionable advice and encouragement. TK is a true multi-hyphenate: reporter-producer-host-writer, and she began her career as a nurse before making the move to audio full time. I’m so excited to feature an interview with her this month.
Photo courtesy of Keisha TK Dutes.
AW: You got into the audio industry as an adult after a career change, what was that like?
TK: My experience is a little unorthodox! While I had gone into the healthcare industry working as a nurse I had always stayed adjacent somehow to audio. I was slowly introducing myself to the industry, the skills and to people on the nights and the weekend.
So that’s what it looked like, it looked like a very slow shift, because life being what it is, you end up having to take care of things, of people, trying to get other opportunities, trying to make money, trying to eat.
AW: What was that first new audio experience like?
TK: That first experience was at WBAI Pacifica, which is a legendary public radio station in New York City and Pacifica stations are all across the country, very small, very left wing and very people centric.
I got an opportunity to be on their youth produced social justice show and I stayed there for seven years. And I ended up being an executive producer by the time I left; the person who makes it happen and points at people and “Who’s coming?” and booking guests. I didn’t know that’s what it was, I just ended up stepping into a role that was natural to me as someone who likes to get things done, who likes a certain level of organization.
AW: Were there barriers to you getting an internship because you were shifting careers?
TK: The main barrier to me getting a true internship was that I had to work full time and go to school full time. I was not afforded the opportunity to work for someone for free. You're keeping out a whole group of people just because they can't, they can't do it, they physically can't be in two places at once.
Resources
During one of my last internships I remember slacking my fellow interns asking if they wanted to get coffee or lunch and occasionally getting the response “I can after my standup” or “We’re about to have a standup.” I remember thinking, “What the hell are they talking about? Everyone here is sitting down.”
It can be hard to ask “What does that mean?” when it seems like all the people around you are on the same page. So, I put together a (very incomplete, I’m sure) list of terms that you might hear thrown around during the production of a radio show or podcast.
NPR’s training website has an awesome glossary, so I’m only covering terms here that aren’t already on their list.
Ambi: The sound of the space that you’re in. For example, ambi of a party would include people pouring drinks or chatting casually.
Billboard: A section at the beginning of a broadcast where the host gives a preview of what’s going to be covered that hour.
Coda: A bit of audio that comes after the credits.
Cold open: A bit of audio that comes before the host introduces the show. If you watch a sitcom like The Office you’ll recognize this as the scene that comes right before the theme music hits.
Compression: Compression is a way of processing audio to limit the loudest noises and elevate the quiet ones. You can learn more about compression and loudness in Transom’s podcasting basics guide.
Crashing: Working full force, usually on a deadline. When I’m crashing, you’ll find empty seltzer cans, iced coffee and Trader Joe’s snacks on my desk. If someone says they’re crashing, leave them alone unless something is literally on fire.
Cuts: A section of tape (it basically means the same thing as “clip”).
Cut/Copy: When a host reads the copy (narration) around a cut (bit of audio). Also sometimes referred to as a “wrap.”
Graf (and nutgraf): Slang for “paragraph.” A nut graf comes early in the piece and delivers essential information to the listener.
High pass (and low pass): A high pass is a type of process (think of it like a filter) applied to audio that removes lower frequencies and allows high ones. A low pass removes high frequencies and allows low ones. For more on audio levels and processing, check out this Transom guide.
Midroll: An ad that comes in midway through the episode (and ads can come in at different times so, pre-rolls come before the episode itself starts, and a post-roll after it ends).
MUX: An abbreviation for music, usually used in a script to indicate when the music will be introduced.
Pickup: Sort of like an express version of re-tracking. They’re very small changes that need to be made, like fixing the pronunciation of someone’s name or fixing a stumble in the original tracking.
Post: Term used in scoring (adding music to) an episode. “Hitting the post” means that dialogue or tracking is lined up to hit on the downbeat, climax or start of a musical phrase.
Pre-interview: An interview, usually not recorded, usually done by a producer, that’s used to assess whether the host or reporter should interview the source on tape. It’s also a way to gather information that will help the producer write a better list of questions.
Pull: Basically grabbing or otherwise acquiring tape. “Can you pull that cut of Wendy talking about Jamie Spears?” means getting this audio into the editing software of your choice.
Q-Line: A list of questions (that’s what the ‘Q’ stands for) that the producer and interviewer work on together before an interview.
Scratch Tracking: The radio equivalent of a rough draft, the narration will never see the light of day, it’s just there so that people internally can get an idea of what the episode will sound like. Sometimes scratch tracking is done by producers.
Signpost: A clear signal written into tracking that tells the listener what is about to happen or what they should expect to hear in the episode.
Stand-up (part of production): A quick team meeting, often used to discuss what each person is doing that day or where a particular project stands. Can be done sitting, standing, or virtually.
Stand-up (in broadcast): When a reporter goes to a location and talks about it, “I’m here at the ticker tape parade for the U.S. Women’s National Team, who are returning to the U.S. after winning the Women’s World Cup.”
Stems: Recordings separated into various tracks, usually used in the context of music/scoring. So you might see one track for the guitar, one for drums, one for synth. Having stems is especially helpful if you love a track but want to change it slightly by removing or reducing the sound of one element.
Tracking: Narration from the host or reporter. Re-tracking means re-recording narration to make edits. It can be both a verb and a noun (fun!). “I have tracking with Miriam at 4pm” means that I’ll be recording Miriam and coaching her through that process. “I’m going to cut Miriam’s tracking” means that I’m editing her recording.
Classifieds
Associate Producers:
Associate Producer (UK Shows), Pushkin Industries
Associate Producer (Business and Tech), Pushkin
Associate Producer (Planet Money), NPR, $70,000 (FYI, AP jobs at NPR have a minimum salary of 70k. Thanks, SAG-AFTRA!)
Associate Producer (Jay Williams Interview Show), NPR, $70,000
Associate Producer (All Things Considered), NPR, $70,000
Associate Producer (Children’s History Podcast), American Public Media
Assistant Producer (Insight), CapRadio
Fellowships:
Kroc Fellowship, NPR $50,000 stipend
Internships:
Intern, APM Reports $15/hr
Intern, Oregon Public Broadcast $16/hr
Intern, WUNC $12-18/hr
Free training programs
Paid workshop “centering Indigenous stories and storytellers,” NextGenRadio & Native American Journalists Association
The BIPOC Audio Story Slingshot, AMPed
TK Recommends:
HiberNation: I executive produced this podcast for Spoke in partnership with Headspace. It's about sleep and the ways it brings society together. The whole series has unexpected love, pain, and a few ghosts.
Not Past It: 9/11 Makes Me Uncomfortable: I like how this episode of Not Past It looks at 9/11 from the complicated view of a first gen child of immigrants and their relationship with the flag post 9/11.